Freelancer - The Void

and @ darkpand0r:
HC is my main server, PvP is FAR improved there thanks to the lack of CD spam. People who can't fly their ship spam CD's against people who've taken time to learn how to fly their ship. The argument that it is a fair tactic is purely false. Yes, they're part of the game. That does not mean they're a fair part of the game. Their use in pvp against guns only fighters is pathetic.

I'm afraid i disagree, fight any fighter outside of Hamburg City and they don't fight well, i've known many players that came to pure vanilla and improved their skills.

also, so your saying. If i can outturn someone, and then slow his turning ability to get a few more shots on him, thats not fair? That is a very fair tactic, and anyone who feels that they should be able to fly about without hassle in a game like this is just silly...

Besides, i find this game FAR more interesting if you learn to rise above and beat players who fight using bizzare tactics. I've tried HC and im not a fan, ill admit that im not the best there but i've not lost a fight to Hamburg City players when they came to my server (which no longer excists...)

No one can compare pvpers from void to HC. Ill tell you why.

HC

HC - no thruster drain for a start
HC - no power loss to guns except for the RARE individual.
HC - cd dont kill EK eagles can slide all day long without fear of being knocked out of EK
HC - ship and gun speed - SLOW

Void

Void - Thruster drain - you run out and your in trouble.
Void - power loss to guns - again run out your in trouble - my current set up can fire for 4 seconds and its out. Its a brawler
Void - cds kill your EK - no endless sliding here
Void - ship speed - forward velocity of the ships and projectile speed of the guns is much much faster.

Trying to say 1 servers pvpers are better than others on a server thats so vastly different is just pie in the sky, its like trying to compare chalk and cheese.
2 servers with completly different ways of fighting.

retributions kind of hit the nail on the head here

Apologies to all for interupting the post with other issues.
please accept my apologies.

Regards,
XENON

No one can compare pvpers from void to HC. Ill tell you why.

HC

HC - no thruster drain for a start
HC - no power loss to guns except for the RARE individual.
HC - cd dont kill EK eagles can slide all day long without fear of being knocked out of EK
HC - ship and gun speed - SLOW

Void

Void - Thruster drain - you run out and your in trouble.
Void - power loss to guns - again run out your in trouble - my current set up can fire for 4 seconds and its out. Its a brawler
Void - cds kill your EK - no endless sliding here
Void - ship speed - forward velocity of the ships and projectile speed of the guns is much much faster.

Trying to say 1 servers pvpers are better than others on a server thats so vastly different is just pie in the sky, its like trying to compare chalk and cheese.
2 servers with completly different ways of fighting.

I wasn't trying to compare the servers, was replying to a comment from someone stating that PVP is vastly improved by the changes and that it would work here too.

I'm close to the best pvper on HC and probably the best brawler on the void and i can honestly say the HC training is the reason why. As long as i'm fighting a ship with comperable turn rate as mine i *never* have to worry about getting out turned, even if i just sit in one spot and box. I never sit on hamburg because over there they make you pay for it unless you have exceptionally superb aim. Hamburg training is the reason i can keep up with - and some times out turn - the paper planes of the void. They are different styles of pvp but i believe that in terms of overall development of the fundamental concepts (ie: dodging and turning) hamburg city is about a year ahead of the voids development. The reason top HC fighters tend to do poorly on the void is due to the fact that they have trouble applying those concepts in the higher-speed CD spammy Void. People like me however he played on the void prior to playing Vanilla have more success applying the concepts learned.

And yes pand0r, if you get behind someone and fire a few CD's you've just done something unfair. You've caused him to do alot of work while you only had to do a little. It's not balanced. I really wish for once a Pro-CDer would give a legitimate argument for their opinion that stretches beyond "I DO THIS AND IT'S FAIR!". You see me making logical points that have solid ideas backing them up? How would you like it if say... you wanted to ban a certain ingredient in toothpaste that was causing your teeth to rot from the inside out but no matter how scientifically sound and progressive your argument against it was the toothpaste companies ended up winning the arguments via spam of "WE'VE BEEN DOING IT THIS WAY FOR A LONG TIME IT MUST BE FIEN KTHXBAI". You'd be pretty disgruntled knowing your teeth were rotting away and you can't do anything about it because people aren't taking 2 minutes to seriously weigh the facts.

Meh gotta disagree there m8.

If i can stop that sniping eagle from sliding around behind me, even if he looses its EK only for a few seconds, long enough to turn the nose of my fat ass brawler nose around then its a valid tactic.
Out-turning a ship here isnt hard to do, except if there using missiles your probably dead while you do it, keep ur eyes on that missile boat is a must hence cds on void are amust.

Again its trying to compare HC to void, Void is totally different - here cds are a necessaty - on HC you have nerfed them - chalk and cheese my friend chalk and cheese.

Agree'd with retribution.

That was the point i was trying to make, maybe spamming is a little harsh, but there is always gonna be spam in these sort of games be some players....

Btw, HC is not vanilla, nowhere close.....

The paper plane vs fattie argument for validation of CD spam is somewhat legitimate. But two wrongs still don't make a right. And if it's true that most people only spam CD's against paper planes then why haven't I fought most people? Because i can count on one hand the number of fighters i've fought who had hornets but chose not to use them. Oh hey... only one of my fingers is up, that must be because i've only seen one person on the void do it. ME!

>.<

I fire one hornet per pass when im flying at my opponent, to deflect their CD and missile if they use them, never more than one CD as thats how i was trained.

Maybe your mistaken?

Btw, what name you use on HC?

I'm not.

IMMORTAL-Cinder is my name, also go by or have gone by: 31337, The~Twister, and [Assassine]-Thastos-[x]

Different Mods play differently. After all, that's one main reason to do mods in the first place.

Is it fair to have CD stop engine kill? Maybe that is the wrong question. Because, as long as it's the same for everyone, basically it is fair play.
Is it logical? Maybe a wrong question, too, in a game spaceships move at max 400 Km/h, lasers shoot 1Km far in space, planets are just some Km apart.

When you are heavily relying on engine kill, CD may seem unfair to you- because it disrupts the tactic you use and learned. It's only natural that you feel better on a mod which does not take that advantage from you. You may already guess what I am up to: if your learned tactic fails under different circumstances (read: another mod) you may have to change your tactis.

Some people loathe missiles- they have either to accept them, try to find people who fight without them, or find a server which nerfed them.
On the same level, some people might loathe a pvp which consists of endless slides without any chance to interrupt them. To them, the ability to stop Engine Kill is an asset.

Of course, we are talking about extremes here: CD/missile spam is one extreme, endless sliders another. And there is always a possibility to make someone elses life miserably

Cheers

Becker

its like i come in forums and say to remove all brawling guns, cds, missiles and only use lasers so i can kill anyone because lasers are the weapons i use better and without cd that stop my EK, missiles that hit me from everywhere i can kill anyone.

IMO this whole debate is just about it