Trade routes in new mod

[geromix]

[quote="McViper";p="210063"]well it is an old topic but i want to answer :
personally i just hate trading coz i'm lazy
i don't undertsand that in same time for trading and same cargo i have took time to trade till i had 150millions in anither mod the BSG one...
1-the AT is boring
2-piracy is dead everyone fights in sparta and it makes an epic lag
3-v nice gero, 200k tax must be ABOLISHED !!! of coruse when we see the profit in void in the NB route and the ridicoulous tax ! 11mil / 200k....that's very loow !!
4-create new ships and guns, it will make traders bring money for discovering shis and expansive guns
5-abolish the "normal" setups, ffs i always see same setups, lasers or nirvanas or anhilators ! (or some more), so i rly think we shud create 20 new ships and not poor ones like tomahawk, true ones like viper and wa1 !
6-same for guns, create 20 more ! it will make pvp's more fun and making traders wanna trade to buy those guns
7-abolish this annoying 3D sys situation by, like zeb said, creating trade lanes....plus those ones must have SPECIAL guns and ship which we can't find anywhere ! it will increase void fun
8-get rid of this quick way NY -> sparta, make it more long ! ---> NB route will be harder.
9-create a dynamic economy like HHC, they change routes every 30mins....===> NO ROUTE WILL BE THE SAME PROFITABLE ALL THE DAY. then we can create mooore trade routes==> piracy revived.
10-increase ships and capital ships prices to minimum 12 millions...and guns more than 1 million
11-create a new kind of RP : the police against smuggling....we r bored to see good side always fighting evils only..boring routine.
12-this police against smuggling will be posted on important points of routes, ofc we must create black market goods too !
13-those BMG's must be the most profitable
14-and create new ships and traders and guns that's the most important !!! (repeating that for the second time)
15-an original idea, that to change guns power every day or every week (not every 30 mins coz it can bores v much)...just as the goods for trading !---> this will make players to buy weps = deposing money, => trading like hell and that will make police smuggling alive(i know this idea is a bit hard to put on the mod...it can has bad consequences that i know)


with this trading will see a new day===> alll server will have a refresh of sparta and the boring routes and setups

Best Regards
McViper[/quote]

Not bad.You have summed it up well.

[=ESF=XENON]

[quote="Hash";p="206976"]Got something to add here: and what about mining!?, Freelancer has the possibilty of mining and it's been forgotten. We all know why..., you need about 2 weeks to fill up an AT and it's kinda boring.[/quote]

:-$  :-$  :-$  :-$

[Retribution]

[quote="BabaRoga
I know for the current routes, but as I said you didn't get the point. I tried to make support for all those people who want to play traders RP  and to encourage  them by mod improvements to trade in bigger numbers.  We don't see them because they can get money more easily from mission,

This not true baba m8, no offence - Missions had a sledgehammer taken to them and were nerfed so hard they are barly viable.

Trading on the other hand, is so simple even I can make money doing it. I currently make 100 mill in about 2 hours - if I feel like it.

The lack of traders come from the fact that once you have 2 bill on x amount of chars, theres nothing in this mod to buy thats even going to make a dent in that wallet. I personnly think everything too cheap, EPECIALLY ammo, ships and weapons.

[Stoertebecker]

Many people have pointed out the problems already. Partly they come from the mod, partly simply from the way freelancer has been designed.

As an additional problem, there is actually a kind of inflation on void. Since the introduction of the AT, money is avaiable faster and in bigger amounts. Which- RP wise- makes it worthless. Not to mention the heavy bias against pirates which almost always is present on this server.

What can be done? As I have already said ages ago, people need something to spend money for, not only something to gain money with.

The catch is- not everyone likes trading. People who don't like it should still be able to play their game. So simply increasing ammo and weapon costs a thousandfold is not the answer.
Some possibilities I see:

-Expensive stuff for clans, which does *not* affect gameplay directly (clan bases, custom ship skins etc)
-maybe the formation of trade guilds. Every trader contributes to a bank cash account of his guild, I.e. the wealthiest guilds could be handed awards to, like being the "rhineland prime government supplier of the month".
-*BEEEP* finally accept that pirates are an enrichment for a server!!!!!And drop the regulations on taxing. A pirate who taxes too much will not earn anything, anyway. And if people just want to annoy traders...well then there are tags like [R] anyway.

cheers

Becker

[McViper]

ur second point, becker, is allready present in the Syndicate clan. For enterring them, the player must pay 50 millions contibuting to the general bank of the clan.
Make it in trade guilds is good too.
ur first point is good too...that to make "extra" stuff for clans, like custom clan bases, or custom ships, custom BATTLESHIPS with special skin related to teh Reavers clan for e.g. (that bs must be dark with red drawing relating to the dark RP), and why not special guns and commodities..
well mining isn't interesant, coz it is simple. If u go to dreasden for diamonds, u will meet with bundshuch npc's...and w all know AT is weak...and if a new mining ship will be created, i don't think it will have great success

but as gero said, we can have same ratio for little way with little money and big route with big profit...but u forgot one thing. That long routes r more dangerous than the way of baby or NT, one trade lane only....
That's why those little ways must have 1/2 or 1/3 of the ratio of the big routes. It is simple : u wanna earn money ? Then take the necessary risks.
Ure a new trader with weak ships ? Then earn money by easy routes and if u die u won't loose big money, but u should know this way take 3* time than the long route for earning the same amount of money for e.g. due to a weaker ratio of the little route.

Regards
McViper

[geromix]

[quote="Stoertebecker";p="210109"]Many people have pointed out the problems already. Partly they come from the mod, partly simply from the way freelancer has been designed.

As an additional problem, there is actually a kind of inflation on void. Since the introduction of the AT, money is avaiable faster and in bigger amounts. Which- RP wise- makes it worthless. Not to mention the heavy bias against pirates which almost always is present on this server.

What can be done? As I have already said ages ago, people need something to spend money for, not only something to gain money with.

The catch is- not everyone likes trading. People who don't like it should still be able to play their game. So simply increasing ammo and weapon costs a thousandfold is not the answer.
Some possibilities I see:

-Expensive stuff for clans, which does *not* affect gameplay directly (clan bases, custom ship skins etc)
-maybe the formation of trade guilds. Every trader contributes to a bank cash account of his guild, I.e. the wealthiest guilds could be handed awards to, like being the "rhineland prime government supplier of the month".
-*BEEEP* finally accept that pirates are an enrichment for a server!!!!!And drop the regulations on taxing. A pirate who taxes too much will not earn anything, anyway. And if people just want to annoy traders...well then there are tags like [R] anyway.

cheers

Becker[/quote]

I will second all that,especially regarding pirates.

Though i would agree with Ent here, some kind of inflation is needed that should make things very expensive,especially the equipments/ships that are very popular.(You know demand is more, so price should be more.The price of a ship like Anubis should be increased a lot.)

If i am not wrong there could be changes regarding clan bases,we could put weps platform etc. in the future.

Though this will not be introduced in the coming mod(2145) according to Vector x,as he mentioned that there will be no changes in bases,nor will there be any clan ships/skins in the coming mod.

I think it will be worth asking questions like the following to the mod-makers-
What will be status of trading in new mod?
Will there be changes for pirates?
Any possibilities for enhancing mining in the mod?
Would trade routes be longer?
Will there be any new transports/freighters etc?

-Geromix

[Gabriel_Angelos]

Funny how this "Trade Guild" for each clan thing has popped up, we in the Marauders have had a dedicated Trade Fleet for some time, making the clan money for those who don't like Trading much (like me but if I have to I will), to help set up new members when they join and also to pay for our Clan base when we get given the ok for it, although we've all had a hand in that, and anything else we might be able to get our grubby hands on in the future.

[Stoertebecker]

My idea of guild competition was a little more globally. Of course it's fine if clans do their own version there, like gabriel wrote.

But imagine...I.E. on the void website there is a list of the wealthiest clans/guilds (maybe represented by a special bank account per clan/guild). And a list of what merits they get from it- so other clans/guilds might get motivation to beat them, financially. Or to wage a company war, cutting into their enemies profits.

The merits should not be in the game mechanics, a) to don't put much load on the modders and b) don't ruin the game for others. Example could be: a monthly updated influence chart, based around a home system picked by the guild and the amout of cash they made last month.

Cheers

Becker

edit; @geromix, IMHO there is a deflation needed rather than another inflation. After all...why should it be (comperativly) easy to reach the max cash account for a charackter (approx 2 bill. if my memory serves right)

[geromix]

[quote="Stoertebecker";p="210124"]My idea of guild competition was a little more globally. Of course it's fine if clans do their own version there, like gabriel wrote.

But imagine...I.E. on the void website there is a list of the wealthiest clans/guilds (maybe represented by a special bank account per clan/guild). And a list of what merits they get from it- so other clans/guilds might get motivation to beat them, financially. Or to wage a company war, cutting into their enemies profits.

The merits should not be in the game mechanics, a) to don't put much load on the modders and b) don't ruin the game for others. Example could be: a monthly updated influence chart, based around a home system picked by the guild and the amout of cash they made last month.

Cheers

Becker

edit; @geromix, IMHO there is a deflation needed rather than another inflation. After all...why should it be (comperativly) easy to reach the max cash account for a charackter (approx 2 bill. if my memory serves right)[/quote]

I don't know about listing clans in terms of wealth,it could provide with some motivation to accumulate greater wealth but it would not be enough.

Lots of clans have their own bank chars etc,some have their own trading wings and nearly all are wealthy.

If some kind of guild account is to be created u must have the ability to buy something with it.
Wealth is good but u should have the ability to show it off through increased expenditure.

Lets say a rich clan can get weps platform on their base,'subsidize' expensive weps/equips sold on their base(make them cheaper than what u can get elsewhere),get more ships etc.That will make it worth all the trouble.

As far as inflation is concerned,it must be accompanied with greater difficulty/challenge+fun in getting money.
(And that should not mean lowering profits,but by making trade routes longer,tougher,bringing back piracy etc.
Slowdown wealth accumulation through challenges but don't stop it.
Profits are incentives,they should not be lowered in any circumstance)

For mining,it should be made a lot easier.(A special mining ship,more fields,more quantity per shot,greater profits etc)

The level of fun needs to be increased by putting in hostile NPCs in mining fields and thereby making it important for an escort to be present while mining.

-Geromix

[Gabriel_Angelos]

I think it would be a good idea to have a collective clan bank account, only problem is:

1)  Would anyone in the clan be able to spend the money contained or just specific members, like clan leader or certain designated officers

2)  If it was only to be spendable through the clan base/planet for specific things like weps platforms, how could it be implemented (extra commodities screen or a new command in FLHook)?

One idea that I just had whilst typing this (even though it's more about the broader picture of the new mod) is that this whole financial influence thing, it would be quite smart if in future, each clan could have it's own unique system, one or two planets in it as well as some natural features (upto the Dev Team), then if we are getting regular updates, periodically have it so that if we accumulate so much money between updates we can have the clan base, then later extra trade lanes linking the planets and base, platforms, as well as the ability to add other stations of our choosing (all within reason of course, having 200 stations in one system would be overkill), purchase NPC's defense wings that if destroyed respawn every 30 mins or something (upto a maximum of perhaps 10 NPC squadrons per clan home system). Add to that the ability to influence our own "supply and demand" by trading from outside the system and the possibilities are endless.

I think if each clan were to be able to build up their own system from scratch it would greatly increase the amount of Trading players as well as add the incentive to keep it going and earn alot of credits, or mine particular materials.  How much more dynamic would it be if you had to bring in a certain amount of Niobium, Silver and Scrap from outside your system to a specific planet or station in order to build more stuff for your defenses??

I've rambled on a bit, so this probably makes little sense but you might see what I'm thinking about

[McViper]

well ur idea is nice, trading metal and selling them on a base for building it...it will make a real sense
to increase the fun in this case, we can increase the win by doing trade missions like :

Building a new base on the system xxxxx :
Hello dear space pilots, we r building a new base in the system xxxxx, but our stock r empty, so we need a corageous trader for us to trade metal, we shall show him 75% of his win as a supplement.

I had the idea about ownship system and i have spoken about this with an admin :
He said me when it was on void, it made more bad than good things.

and exactly, when i listen about that story about homesystem blockade 2007 group 61. I see there was bad things : alex turned into non-pvp zone, so all clans fought for one thing : make alexandria as a pvp zone and it make a very big problem with admins etc...

But ur idea is good gab

Regards
McViper

[geromix]

I think this idea is good getting metals etc for bases but i think the implementation would be really difficult.And i don't think this is being considered by Dev Team or Mod-Makers.

Its unlikely that this will come anytime soon but it could be something for the far future.

-Geromix

[McViper]

Far future ? how HHC can do web missions and web controlled missions ??? all kinds : killing ships, trading etc....
It is not for far future if our  modders find something to do with fl and make it accepting missions comming from a website.

Regards
McViper

[darthnova]

McViper I think that is an idea better suited for events in my opinion. I can Imagine something like this: The Orion clan base has been under heavy attack by nomads and new supplies of metal and H fuel are needed. There would be a required amount of 1500 units of metal and 1500 of H fuel. These 2 armoured transports full of cargo would be heavily defended by navy forces. Then the nomad npc's will guard the base. However, before the AT's can make it to the base, there is a well organised strike force of say 6 evils. They would attempt to kill some of the navy fighters and do heavy damage to the AT's. Then they would retreat and meet up with the full scale evil armada holding the base in a seige. Once dead you can not rejoin the event. If the good side manage to get the supplies to the base but the seige is still not broken then it ends in a stalemate - supplies are there to rebuild base and H fuel for the fighters but the food supply will be running low. If the good side destroy the seige and get the supplies to the base then it is a victory for the good side. If neither supplies are given to the base or blockade destroyed then it is a victory for evil. Thats my idea of puting it into practice anyway.

[geromix]

[quote="McViper";p="210206"]Far future ? how HHC can do web missions and web controlled missions ??? all kinds : killing ships, trading etc....
It is not for far future if our  modders find something to do with fl and make it accepting missions comming from a website.

Regards
McViper[/quote]

Well you see the reason  is that there has been no word from Mod-Makers on this,even in previous updates this maybe wasn't considered and instead we had the dynamic economy update.
At the moment i foresee that the mod-makers are concentrating more on new ships and dealing with 3D systems for next mod.(2145)

They may therefore take this up later.I may be wrong but this is what i think.

As i said it will be good but the only way this can happen is when there will be large support for this.

We have been debating and putting forward new ideas but all this would come to naught if this cannot be 'delivered' to the Dev Team with support from as many people as possible.

Refer to my previous idea of making a list of such ideas/suggestions and then getting clans/individuals to sign it(a signature campaign).After that we submit them formally.Everything will then rest on mod-makers ability and will to do this.

That is all we can do,from community side.

-Geromix